I’m sitting in a five star hotel in New Delhi writing this and two tables away are two freelancers talking about the death of the newspaper industry, just amazing. Since October things in the business have gotten a bit dicey for all of us. Many friends of mine have been laid off by papers in the States. A few good dailies, including the Rocky (one of my favorites) have gone the way of the Dodo. Its a very frightening time in the news business.
One of the reasons I started this blog was to share my photographic experiences with other photographers. A major part of that experience is the business side of photography and in times like these how we, as photographers, as freelancers, as journalists deal with our clients is the of the utmost importance. Placing a value on our time, or vision, our creativity is getting harder and harder to do with magazines cutting budgets and work drying up.
Recently, an editor from a magazine (who shall remain nameless) contacted me for a job. A travel piece on Mumbai. I’ve shot it 10 times already. No problem. I know it inside and out. 48 hours in Mumbai. I ask for the locations they would like photographed and a budget. From experience I know this is a two day job with two long day charges. Up before dawn shoot till 8, breakfast, shoot indoor locations, lunch, nap, evening light shooting, night shots, home, rinse and repeat.
The editor emails:
The text for the story will be in on Thursday the 26th and it would be great to have the images in the following Thursday 2nd. My budget for this piece is $500 SGD
500 SGD is around 325 dollars. That is not enough money for a job like this. I politely turned down the work not only because the money was much too low but also because I was booked with other jobs until well after the deadline. I did however make sure that I explained that the money was much too low saying:
My lowest day rate (8 hours) for a travel magazine assignment is $500.00 USD plus expenses including digital transfer, transportation and meals for the day. I’m happy to work with you but I can’t do it for less than that.
Now I understand that times are tough but as photographers, as communicators we need to place a value on that work. It is important to get paid for the work that we do. Not excessively, but reasonably. We have to pay our rent, we have to eat, we have equipment to purchase and maintain, we have to live. People pay for the plane tickets that the airline sells. They buy the products that are advertised in the magazine and they read the stories while they are going to far off cities and stay in expensive hotels.
The editor responded:
That is a shame. I understand the fee isn’t as high as you would like but please understand that this is for a low budget airline that is only seen within India – which unfortunately for us, means our budget is low. We are based in Asia which reflects our budget and we pay in SGD.
It is a relatively new magazine and I have found if hard to get hold of good photographers based in India. ____________________ our London office recommended you to me and I was hoping we would be able to build a working relationship. I could draw some budget from a different article and up the fee to $600 SGD , can you work with this?
She also said in a subsequent email:
I would really like to work with you on this, as is would be great to get your work in our magazine.
The editor literally offered another 50 dollars. But more than that the editor said something very, very important. She said that I have found if hard to get hold of good photographers based in India. She values my work. She likes my work. She wants it more than other photographers that she works with. On a side note I have to say that there are a number of incredibly talented photographers in India. There is no dearth of talent here. I could name 25 photographers in Mumbai and New Delhi that could do a fantastic job on this story. But back to the real issue here. This editor wants me to shoot these pictures because she values my work, unfortunately that value does not transfer into monetary compensation. In addition she wants to start a long working relationship based on an initial sub standard pay rate.
Not a good way to start a working relationship. When I start working with someone I want it to be based on mutual admiration AND mutual compensation. I do not like to be taken advantage of whether it is intentional or not. I’ve been thinking about this issue lately so I hacked out a response:
I agree, my work would be great for your magazine. I’m not saying that because I have an absurd opinion of myself, but instead because I have the ability to photograph a good story with well composed, thoughtful images that people enjoy seeing. Getting my work to the point where my images look this way took a lot of time, training and sacrifice. Look at it this way because it is exactly the same thing; I love the way a 5 series BMW drives. I love the way it looks and the way it feels. It is a fantastic car. I could go into a dealership and tell them that I want to give them 25k for the car and they would say no. Not only because it costs 60k but because it is WORTH 60k. My work is worth much more than 500 dollars a day plus expenses. That is my lowest rate for small magazines and it is only there because sometimes I will take assignments that interest me for less than I normally charge. It is not negotiable.
That said, I do want to work with you on future projects so if you can find the space in your budget to hire me I think we could make some great pictures. I’m CCing this email to my agent so you can contact them directly for assignments. I’m often unreachable for weeks at a time while traveling and working in extremely remote areas. Laura knows my schedule and can book me accordingly.
The editor should be getting into the office in a few hours. We’ll see what she says. I don’t think the budget will move to a place where I’m happy with it and it really doesn’t matter for this job because I’m booked solid until well after the deadline. My hope is that she will begin to understand that if you want good work from experienced people you need to pay rates that reflect the product.
What do you all think? What would you have done? Questions? Comments?
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COMMENTS / 16 COMMENTS
Gavin la Grange added these pithy words on Mar 26 09 at 1:03 amI think you did brilliantly – the BMW analogy was really very well done.
Even if work starts drying up for us photographers I really hope that we don’t just lower our rates to cope. I only discovered your blog a few days ago but you do fantastic work, and to charge any less than 500us a day for your services would be near criminal. I’d have to charge $50 a day in that case – I’m only a fraction as good as you!
Cary added these pithy words on Mar 26 09 at 1:24 amThe example with the BMW I think is appropriate. I am amazed how people fail to make the connection of image quality (and a sort of “soft value”) and what that translates to in units of money (”hard value”?). I see tons of photographers grasping for anything they can get and severely undervaluing the work they are capable of: very often doing just as you say—starting off on an unfortunate foot for the relationship.
From what you have provided it sounds like you’ve handled it dead on. It would have to be pretty amazingly interesting to do it for less than one’s bottom line, and that, for me, normally means doing it practically for free for the sake of the project.
Well played, I’d say.
Justin added these pithy words on Mar 26 09 at 12:14 pmGreat read Michael, good for you for putting this out there. I run into stuff like that here in Vietnam all the time and it can be tough to do the right thing when you have a bad month as a freelancer. On different topic but money related I’m now waiting 6 months to get paid a few thousand dollars for an assignment. No issues with the images, client was happy, story published, etc, but for some reason they feel it’s okay to take this long to pay me. No one is really apologetic for the delayed payment. Pretty shitty that we can go shoot a story last minute, arrange logistics in a day or two, and deliver the final images on deadline but getting an accounting department to pay you in a reasonable amount of time is such a challenge. Sorry I’m using your blog to vent here but I figured it all related to the shitty business practices going around these days.
Michael added these pithy words on Mar 26 09 at 9:41 pmI am not blaming digital photography because lord knows we all use it but the problem lies in the fact that somebody WILL do it for far far below industry standard. Nevermind the fact that the images are sub par. The opinion of image making has come down drastically in the last 5 years and I can’t help but think that its because everybody and their cousin has a digi rebel. In these times we need to stand strong and separate ourselves from the herds.
Craig Volpe added these pithy words on Mar 27 09 at 2:13 amMichael, thank you so much for posting this. You take amazing images, but there are amazing images everywhere. Matters of business and the realities of being a freelancer, on the other hand, are much harder to come across and therefore I find it incredibly valuable when I come across this kind of stuff.
Colin McAuliffe added these pithy words on Mar 30 09 at 11:45 amNot having much experience in the freelance field, but I’ll still chime in. I think it’s important to stand your ground in this situation. Even if it’s a low budget airline, it’s important to us photographers to not undervalue our skill. It could have been easy to just shrug them off and say can’t help you, i’m booked maybe throw some of those other 25 photographers names their way. Hopefully they wouldn’t budge on cost either. But good to try and keep the door open with them for the future. I think it was handled with the greatest of professionalism.
Ritesh added these pithy words on Mar 31 09 at 4:40 amwell done…i guess, a collective is the need of the hour.
michael rubenstein added these pithy words on Apr 01 09 at 4:25 amRitesh,
I really don’t think that a collective is the need of the hour at all. I think that the need of the hour is photo editors that recognize quality work and are willing to pay for it or at the very least admitting that they are totally under budget and giving you a good reason to do the job other than the money. How exactly is a collective going to help with this situation?
best,
Michael
Leisa added these pithy words on Apr 11 09 at 1:04 pmHi Michael,
I just stumbled over your site- and loved this story. I have lived in Asia for 11 years now (mostly based in Bangkok), and 50% of my work is shooting for mags and newspapers (the other 50% is writing for the same guys). Sadly, I have heard/ experienced this tale all too often… I cant begin to tell you the stories- the legal cases- I have been through extracting cash from (mainly) Singaporean publishers. Its a gross generalization yes, many publishing houses are lazy payers, but the only times I have really had to get heavy is with Singaporeans. Why they are bad is anybodies guess- I love Singapore, and have some top Singaporean friends, but magazines there are notorious for their treatment of freelancers (of any shape). I also know which publishing house your talking about- the mention of the London office and the rate is a dead give away.
Time for a collective? If only it could be that easy. I used to muse over the story about the Philippine maids working in Singapore and the shite they were dished up by their employers- until they formed a union and created a list of rules. Collectivizing the freelance community may take a bit more organizing, granted. But proud that you stood your ground.
At the end of the day I bring it down to this: Ms X (the Singaporean editor) gets paid doesn’t she? She doesn’t have to renegotiate each week for her wage, nor continually ask (aka Justin). You have set a daily rate based upon what others are willing to pay/ think your worth it. If Ms X cant afford that, then its the same story as the BMW (I mean, wouldn’t we all like a BMW?).
But getting photo editors to recognize the quality of work? -if there is little or no work on the table, then an offer from Ms. X (and don’t think these guys will be paying expenses! That’s why they have chosen a Bombay based photographer in the first place)may be rather tempting- regardless of which country they come from.
Its probably not Ms X’s problem- she’s been given orders from above. But at the end of the day, if she cant afford you, she cant afford you. Period. Justin, however, mate- you have some letters to write.
And hey- as a passing thought- there are some great editors/ publications out there- and wow, i haven’t had to squabble over $$ for years. Thank small mercies!
Leisa
Christopher Wise added these pithy words on Apr 12 09 at 12:43 amAt all levels the screws are being turned on independent creatives; from crappy fees, to no expenses, to making us more liable than agencies if a client goes bankrupt. From my own experience the most annoying is the local version of the grand title back in New York or London which wants to be as great as the elder sibling, but has no budget and excuses this by saying the editors at the mothership will soon see my work, hire me and they can pay the proper rates!!!
Another way to look at this (which I admit I have not thought about until reading your post) is to pass the job on to one of the 25 photographers in Mumbai and New Delhi who would be happy to shoot it for those rates. As foreigners working in developing countries we have a pretty sweet deal; accessing interesting stories with access to the, by local standards, generous coffers of various G8 economies, with the low cost of living of our expat lives. And shouldn’t locals shoot their own neighborhoods and get introduced to the rituals and protocols of the global economy? (Of course try convincing a photo editor to hire someone with a funny accent that’s not French or Italian!)
Just a thought.
yudi added these pithy words on Apr 12 09 at 10:30 pmreally a good read,esp in bad financial period.Thank for sharing
Andrei Popovici added these pithy words on May 05 09 at 5:37 pmMichael,
You asked what would us (the readers) do in this situation. I think that each of us would approach the situation differently, based on our location on the scale.
I’m a graduating student, so the opportunity to gain this experience and be published would be worth the fee.
However, this all depends on (a) how starved the photographer is and (b) where one places oneself on the “value” scale.
I am curious how you have arrived at your value of $500/8h. Is it based on the market in your current location? The amount charged by photographers making similar images?
I ask these questions because I’m curious how a fresh graduate like me should think about prices.
michael rubenstein added these pithy words on May 13 09 at 8:24 amAndrei,
I’m going to have to say straight up no. Absolutely not. As a new photographer your job is not to undermine the market for established photographers. Your job is not to undervalue your work. Your job is to do a good job for a fair price. In the magazine world, and please people correct me if I’m wrong, with decent publications an editor will try to hire a photographer for a story and if they can’t find one with work that is good enough for a price they can handle they will buy stock, but they will buy good stock. Just because you’ll work for next to nothing doesn’t mean you’ll get the job. If you want experience, intern. If you don’t feel like you have enough experience, then practice. You need to go to ASMP meetings if you live in the States, talk to them about pricing. Get FotoQuote, it can help you price out jobs and stock. Even better, summer intern at an agency in NYC. BUT FOR THE LOVE OF GOD DO NOT MAKE PICTURES FOR FREE.
As far as how I value my time, a $500.00 phtographer’s fee for a magazine job is the base minimum in the US. That does not include expenses, rentals, filing fees, digital post etc. For the level of imagery this client wanted the two day job most likely would have come to around $2000-$2800 dollars.
Michael Wong added these pithy words on May 17 09 at 6:37 pmMichael,
Right on! Quality requires skill, time, dedication, investment on many levels – in any field. Good businesses are those invest more in quality, rather than spending their energy trying to find ways to cut cost.
By the way, I recently picked up a Digital SLR (can’t NOT buy one!). My pics look much better than they used to, for sure. But I’d have to say that getting to know the minimum about photography it takes to operate the DSLR and seeing my meager results makes me appreciate your work so much more. It’s not easy capturing the moments the way you do.
Michael
“digi rebel” owner
Tara added these pithy words on May 20 09 at 6:17 amI love this posting. I literally gave the same talk to an up and coming photographer that was interning for us recently cause he had a story where he went to some weird little town in the Ukraine, made a beautiful story, spent weeks doing it, and then sold it to a high end agency for a 30-70 split. That’s right. After all that work he got 30% of the profit. Unfreaking-believable… And that’s the problem right there. That’s what brings our industry to its knees…
Brian Morowczynski added these pithy words on May 29 09 at 11:52 amHi Michael-
I can’t tell you how many back and forth discussions I’ve had about this very same topic, every detail of it. I’ve been thinking more and more lately that a business relationship, particularly a new one, cannot start out with a less than ideal or rate. Once a photographer budges on their well-thought out rates, then it will become very difficult, if not impossible to break free from the current rate into what it should have been in the first place. Oftentimes when submitting a bid on a project, I’ve been asked to lower the rate with the spoken promise of future repeat business with the client. I think it was Mark Loundy (http://www.loundy.org/commoncents) who recommended asking for clients to put those promises into writing for the benefit of a lower rate. I think that is the most reasonable response.
BM
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